Select one of the following:
1. Read the chapter "At the Western Palace" carefully. Outline what you believe are the central issues of ethnicity that this chapter in Kingston highlights. In other words make a list of problems, ideas and concerns connected to the issue of ethnicity that this chapter raises, and note the incidents which raise these issues. You don't have to summarize the incidents, just mention them. This question is asking for a list as an answer.
2. Why do we need the chapter "Shaman"? Why is it important for the reader to know about the life of Maxine's mother in China? She is not the protagonist of the text, so why does Kingston spend so much time providing such detailed development of her character? Explain.
3. Explain the ending of "At the Western Palace," which deals with distinguishing between the stories of the insane and the stories of the sane people. Re-read the last few pages of the chapter, and put what Kingston is saying about story in your own words. Then tell me why it's important please.
4. What types of things does Little Maxine have to do that shame her? Why do these things shame her? Why can't she refuse to do them? What do you make of this?
5. What are Maxine's major feelings throughout most of the last chapter? How do you know? What evidence do you have? Please cite. Do her feelings change? From what to what? Why?
Do human feelings change just because we find out about anothers' intentions? Explain.
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ReplyDeleteQuestion 3.)When reading this chapter I really did not expect the story to take the course it had towards the end. Brave Orchid states that “the difference between mad people and sane people is that sane people have variety when they talk-story. Mad people only have one story that they talk over and over.” When trying to pick apart what this sentence means, I personally found her message here to be that what makes one insane is the transformation of their life into a repetitive obsession/ anxiety caused by a change to their physical or mental world which makes them focus on only one significant thing instead of many- almost as if a mad person looses the ability to see outside of their fear and obsession. They loose all sense of imagination.
ReplyDeleteMy grandmother suffered an almost identical fate as Moon Orchid did due to depression, and I find it very interesting that both the character, my grandmother, and many other mentally unstable patients often believe that there is somebody after them that they must hide from, and that their loved ones are in danger of being taken away. I wonder if this is because they also loose faith in those around them (in Moon Orchids case, her husband casts her out).
I feel like what Kingston is trying to say is that story and even our perception of life is all about perspective, our environment, what we long for, and our experiences. The stories we tell depend upon our ideas of what is true and what is not. For Moon Orchid, her insanity was her reality, and while to us it is insane, to her , Brave Orchid was the one who was crazy for not seeing what she did. While Moon Orchid slowly “lost her soul” due to being rejected by her husband (and even grand children) and american culture, when you flip the perspectives Brave Orchid might be seen as the one who was mad for assimilating so “normally”. The clash between old Chinese and new American culture places Moon Orchid in confusion and misplacement.
I think this message is important because in society today we deem those we do not understand crazy, and quite often it is the most intelligent that are isolated because of this. At the end of the story Moon Orchid was once again content with her life and “daughters” because it was what gave her security. Crazy or not it left her at peace, so who is anybody to disturb that? It is the same as fearing the unknown or what we do not have the capacity to understand. Moon Orchid enjoyed following around her grandchild because she was genuinely interested in what, to her, was new and fascinating. The grandchildren however saw her as nutty because it was something they were not used to and had no desire to understand.
2.) The chapter "Shaman" is indeed a very important chapter in the book. The chapter Shaman lets the reader know the truth and the conflicts of Kingston's mother Brave Orchard. Maxine seems to gain some inspiration from her mother in this chapter, as she lets the readers into the struggles and the rewards of Brave Orchid's life. Brave Orchid is described as an intelligent woman who gets to leave her duties as a house wife and a mother, just like the typical Chinese woman. When Brave Orchid is described as a ghost destroyer, an assumption can be made that Maxine's mother is just like Fa Mu Lan. Even though Maxine's views of her mother throughout the book are negative, she describes her mother in this chapter as a wise and very powerful women. According to Kingston, Brave Orchid has transformed into an servant to a powerful and wise individual. Brave Orchid was a so called wife-slave but becomes what Chinese women called "the daydream women" which is to live independently, be respected by all and also to be an educated woman. One of the points Kingston wanted to make was even though Brave Orchid grew up as a young women in China which basically was a waste according to the Chinese culture, she eventually made herself into a well respected and intelligent woman. Another point Kingston made in the chapter Shaman was that even though Maxine and her mother had some sort of separation and tension throughout the book, they both have more of a connection than we think.
ReplyDeleteI love that you pointed out a similarity between Fa Mu Lan and Brave Orchid. While reading I really hadn't thought of that connection at all, and the entire idea of her being a ghost destroyer confused me because I felt as if it came out of nowhere in the story. Now I can see how Brave Orchid is the epitome of a strong female woman that young Chinese girls dream of becoming, exactly like the warrior women in talk-stories. Perhaps that is why Brave Orchid can be so hard on Maxine, because she holds her daughter to the same standard of achievement that she herself was able to attain.
ReplyDeleteQuestion 1
ReplyDeleteAn issue of ethnicity in "The Western Palace" is dealing with the immigrants being looked down on. At one point, Moon Orchid and her nieces and nephews are sitting on apple crates outside of the laundry establishment, and ghosts throw coins at them thinking they're poor. It seems as though they are being judged by their ethnicity. This creates a struggle in their life to be successful and the nieces and nephews stop sitting out front with their aunt, Moon Orchid. Also, Brave Orchid compares her children's behavior to her ethnicity. Brave Orchid thinks that her children are lazy and not polite. At times she evens thinks that they didn't really receive their trophies, "It was hard to believe that they could do the things the trophies said they did"(129). The cultural traditions of her ethnicity are so ingrained in Brave Orchid's mind that she can't accept the ways of America, and it causes her to view her children in a negative light. Moon Orchid's ethnicity also raises an issue for the reason why her husband searched for a new life. Moon Orchid's husband no longer agreed with the ways of Moon Orchid's and also, his ethnicity. So, he moved on to another wife, a reader may say that Moon Orchid confronting her husband may have led to her breakdown.
Question 2
The chapter of the "Shaman" is very important, because Brave Orchid's story-telling shapes little Maxine’s view of life as a child. The mental struggles little Maxine endures is due to the confusion of the stories that her mother tells her. The chapter of the "Shaman" explains the life of Brave Orchid which helps a reader understand the issues little Maxine faced. Commenting on what Angela said about Brave Orchid being portrayed as Fa Mu Lan is a great assertion; Brave Orchid was presented as a strong, intelligent woman. Not only did she destroy ghosts, but she over came stereo types. She became a doctor and was viewed in a strong, positive light, “She had gone away ordinary and come back miraculous, like the ancient magicians who came down from the mountains” (76). She was viewed in the light of a warrior, she was known as an amazing, strong doctor who cured many ill people
1. There are many issues of ethnicity found in "At the Western Palac"e. I agree with the response above that connects the idea of ethnicity with the children in the story. Throughout the chapter, the idea of the American child was brought up over and over again. On page 113, the narrator states that “American children did not understand sitting”. The American children were wandering around the airport spending their money on “pay t.v.’s or the pay toilets (113). This shows the way that children are perceived in America today. Technology plays a huge part in children’s lives today in America. This example also shows the freedom that children are given. Brave Orchid also feels as if the American children had “no feelings and no memory” (115). While waiting for her sister, Brave Orchid stood in line and waited. The exchanging of gifts on page 121 shows a difference between the American beliefs and the Chinese beliefs. When the children start playing with the gifts given to them by Moon, she states, “How greedy to play with the presents in front of the giver. How impolite (“untraditional” in Chinese) her children were” (121). Also, Moon was shocked when she seen the trophies that the children have received . The American children groaned when their aunt complimented them on their achievements. Brave was very confused, and she did not understand why her children would react in such a way. She explained that “it was hard to believe that they could do the things the trophies said they could do (129). This chapter also focuses on the idea of change. Brave convinces Moon to come to America to change her life in a positive way. When Brave’s friends begin to gamble, Brave tells Moon that “when you come to America, it’s a chance to forget some of the bad Chinese habits” (139). Also, Moon’s husband comes to America and makes a life for himself that is completely different from his previous life in China. He marries a new wife, has a career and a home. He explains to Moon that he is “living like an American” (153). He also tells Moon that she does not have the “hardness for this country” (153). It was also interesting to look at the difference between Brave Orchid, who made her new home in America, and Moon, who just landed in America. Brave wanted Moon to be strong and confront Moon’s husband; however, Moon was petrified to do it. She felt as if she received enough from her husband, which was money every month. Without Brave’s opinions and guidance, Moon would have never made her way to America and confronted her husband.
ReplyDeleteQuestion 2)
ReplyDeleteThe chapter "Shaman" is important because it outlines the accomplishments and the struggles that Maxine's mother was faced with. This outlines the difference in Chinese culture versus American culture at the time. I also believe it is an important chapter because it shows how Brave Orchid worked hard to become a doctor and was loved by the people for her work. She stepped outside the boundaries of the culture and, instead of conforming to a "female" role she went ahead and did what she was able to in order to establish her own career path. This is basically what Maxine has done with her life. She became an author and followed her passion instead of conforming to her role so "Shaman" helped the reader and Maxine to see that we should follow our passion and do what we feel we are meant to do. Later in the book it also mentions that when Brave Orchid came to America her diploma was rendered useless and that is why they work at the laundry. This shows how she set out and did everything she had to in order to become an accomplished woman only to have the journey to America oppress her in a sense, leaving her at square one and doing only what is necessary to survive.
I also liked the way Angela made a connection between Brave Orchid and Fa Mu Lan. I did not realize this when I was reading the text but after reading the post I too noticed similarities. Both Fa Mu Lan and Brave Orchid stepped outside of their social boundaries and became powerful women. Brave Orchid achieved a social position that was meant only to be achieved by a male. This reminded me of a quote from the chapter "White Tigers". "Even when you fight against soldiers trained as you are, most of them will be men, heavy footed and rough. You will have the advantage"(32). I found this quote to be important because it shows how Fa Mu Lan was perfect to be a warrior because she was a women and not a large, rough warrior. It shows how there should be no gender discrimination because Fa Mu Lan, a female, is more capable of doing a "man's" work than a man is. This is the same case with Brave Orchid. She is a skilled doctor and therefore gender should have nothing to do with her social status.
Question 2)
ReplyDeleteThe chapter "Shaman" is important because it outlines the accomplishments and the struggles that Maxine's mother was faced with. This outlines the difference in Chinese culture versus American culture at the time. I also believe it is an important chapter because it shows how Brave Orchid worked hard to become a doctor and was loved by the people for her work. She stepped outside the boundaries of the culture and, instead of conforming to a "female" role she went ahead and did what she was able to in order to establish her own career path. This is basically what Maxine has done with her life. She became an author and followed her passion instead of conforming to her role so "Shaman" helped the reader and Maxine to see that we should follow our passion and do what we feel we are meant to do. Later in the book it also mentions that when Brave Orchid came to America her diploma was rendered useless and that is why they work at the laundry. This shows how she set out and did everything she had to in order to become an accomplished woman only to have the journey to America oppress her in a sense, leaving her at square one and doing only what is necessary to survive.
I also liked the way Angela made a connection between Brave Orchid and Fa Mu Lan. I did not realize this when I was reading the text but after reading the post I too noticed similarities. Both Fa Mu Lan and Brave Orchid stepped outside of their social boundaries and became powerful women. Brave Orchid achieved a social position that was meant only to be achieved by a male. This reminded me of a quote from the chapter "White Tigers". "Even when you fight against soldiers trained as you are, most of them will be men, heavy footed and rough. You will have the advantage"(32). I found this quote to be important because it shows how Fa Mu Lan was perfect to be a warrior because she was a women and not a large, rough warrior. It shows how there should be no gender discrimination because Fa Mu Lan, a female, is more capable of doing a "man's" work than a man is. This is the same case with Brave Orchid. She is a skilled doctor and gender should have nothing to do with her social status.
The chapter Shaman is needed to describe the events that took place in Brave Orchards life and to explain some of the reasons why she installs certain things into Maxine as a mother. The chapter shines light on the other daughter relationship that they have. Maxine retells the stories of her mother accomplishments because she doesn’t quite seem to understand how her mother could have accomplished such things but when she accomplishes something of her own ( straight A’s) her mother doesn’t acknowledge them. She views her mother as a strong encourager by her early actions in China but also a hindrance with how she was raised. Maxine looks up to her mother in many ways she considers her intelligent and powerful, most importantly I see how she admires and may even envy her mother for being able to escape many traditional roles,( being a mother and housewife). But then again there is another side of Brave Orchard who constantly reminds and teaches Maxine that she is a “Chinese Woman” in a cultural sense unwanted, useless, and disappointing. I believe she views her mother as a hero but at the same time a bystander. Without the chapter the reader would not understand the hypocrite name that at times I feel Maxine labels her mother as. In china Brave Orchard was something, and in the book it goes to tell about in America she has to work in the fields , come down a notch from where she was. Also this chapter shows hoe Maxine cannot even really believe if anything the stories that her mother tell her. At the beginning of the chapter Brave Orchard tells of how Maxine had a brother and a sister and later on acts as if she has no clue to what Maxine is talking about. The story is confusing to be able to sift through and figure out which part of the story is fact or fiction but then again it makes it to be like no other book I have read before. Even better it is good to know that in a sense the author is in the same position as I am … or is she??
ReplyDelete2.) The chapter titled “Shaman” in Kingston’s The Woman Warrior is essential to the piece because the shifting of focus allows the reader to not only acquire a clearer view of Maxine’s mother as an individual, but also provides an insight into their relationship as mother and daughter. I generally agree with what others have posted in terms of this section of the book being diverse from the chapters prior since it offers a more positive light on Maxine’s mother. I found it interesting that when describing her mother’s class photograph Maxine does not solely focus on her mother in the picture, but rather compares her to the other strangers in the photo. “She is so familiar, I can only tell whether or not she is pretty or happy or smart by comparing her to the other women.” (58) I sensed, for the first time, that Maxine had a great respect for her mother, Brave Orchid, and the hardships she had endured throughout her life in China. In discovering details of Brave Orchid’s life and through the further development of her character, I felt I was able to better understand the values and ethics by which Little Maxine had been raised.
ReplyDelete“Shaman” is important to the novel as a whole since it also emphasizes the divergence in American and Chinese culture. Nearing the end of the chapter, Brave Orchid recounts the sacrifices she had made as a woman in America, paying two-hundred dollars for Maxine’s birth in a hospital when female babies in China were being given away for free. In my opinion, I believe Kingston spends a significant amount of time developing Brave Orchid because, in a way, she is characterizing all the “women warriors” in her novel simultaneously. All the women in her book are warriors in their own right, and Brave Orchid, like Fa Mu Lan and Maxine must overcome adversity in order to find themselves in a culture that commonly devalues women.
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Central Issue #1 – Chinese American Children v. Chinese Children Behaviors
ReplyDeleteThe central issue is that there is a noticeable difference between the way Brave Orchid and Moon Orchid’s children behave. The cultural differences clearly distances the two groups of children.
Example: “Mama!” Moon Orchid’s daughter kept calling. Brave Orchid said to her children, “Why don’t you call your aunt, too? Maybe she’ll hear us if all of you call out together.” But her children slunk away. Maybe that shame-face they so often wore was American politeness.” (Kingston 117-8).
Central Issue #2 – Parental Control
The central issue is that customs from one culture to the next often clash.
Example: “Take more,” she urged. “Take more.” She brought the yellow crystals on a red paper plate to her family, one by one. It was very important that the beginning be sweet. Her children acted as if this eating were a bother. “Take a big piece,” she scolded. She’d make them eat it like medicine if necessary. They were so stupid, surely they weren’t adults yet” (Kingston 121).
Central Issue #3 – Abandonment
The central issue is that Chinese men often abandoned their families in China once they moved to America. This disconnect allows a man to abandon his family in China and create a new family. While the man financially supports his family, there is no longer an emotional connection.
Example: “For thirty years she had been receiving money from him from America. But she had never told him that she wanted to come to the United States. She waited for him to suggest it, but he never did. Nor did she tell him that her sister had been working for a Chinese-American husband for her daughter. Then the daughter had come and had been able to sign the papers to bring Moon Orchid over” (Kingston 124).
The central issues of ethnicity in "At the Western Palace" are issues of the differences and tensions between the traditional Chinese and "American" points of view.
ReplyDeleteBrave Orchid and Moon Orchid represent the traditional Chinese sensibilities that clash with the newer generation's more assimilated "American" ways.
For example, Moon Orchid cannot understand the children who speak in english, and it is like they are from two different worlds. Moon Orchid follows the children around the house as they talk about her craziness. Moon Orchid can't do easy household chores which causes Brave Orchid to consider her useless.
Moon Orchid was left behind by her husband when he left for America, and now that she is in America he has married and started his own family.
Another conflict inherent in the chapter is the submissive role that women have in traditional Chinese culture. As a result of traditional Confucian values, women are completely powerless in society.
The meeting between the Orchid sisters and the doctor ends in disaster, and Moon Orchid eventually loses her sanity as a result.
The two main central conflicts in the chapter are those of old world vs new world, and the oppression of women in Chinese culture. "The Woman Warrior" is a very intense book and the reader can feel Maxine Hong Kingston's impassioned views through her writing. It was interesting that in the interview shown in class, she is more at peace with her culture and history and regrets giving the book a warlike title. However, her struggle shows in "The Woman Warrior" and has a very youthful and powerful message of feminism, and it seems that writing the book helped her not only to reconcile the spirit of her aunt, but also her issues with her life as an emigrant and the oppression that women faced in traditional China and continue to face today.
ReplyDeleteThroughout the last chapter we seem to see Maxine’s emotional transitions from childhood to adulthood. It starts off when she’s in elementary school and has trouble. She’s ashamed of her voice, and she’s afraid to talk. She also feels really ashamed of the way that her mother makes her go to the drugstore to get candy. Her mother is trying to get these people to lift a curse but Maxine knows that she will come off looking like a beggar. She’s ashamed of the traditions her mother follows so stubbornly.
ReplyDeleteAs Maxine gets older her feelings of shame intensify to hatred and anger towards herself and towards those who remind her of her own negative characteristics. She hates the girls she goes to school with who never talks, especially because others seem to group her with this girl and think that they’re friends. She doesn’t like the idea that she might be perceived as weak. She feels inadequate because of the way her mother talks to her and she lashes out at this girl because the girl represents these inadequacies.
Her feelings of self-hatred and anger build up even more as she gets older. She over-reacts about the slow kid that follows her around and when others brush off her irritation with him, she seems to think that they think it’s natural that he’d be there. She feels a constant need to prove her worth to those around her.
She feels like she sticks out as odder than anyone and that everyone else must notice it. She says on page 189, “I thought every house had to have it’s crazy woman or crazy girl, every village it’s idiot. Who would be It at our house? Probably me.”
She allows her shame and anger to build up and doesn’t communicate her feelings to anyone until finally she blows up at her parents about how she’s going to college and she will never get married and tells them about how smart she is until her mother interrupts her and tells her something which takes the wind out of her sails. As Maxine goes on about all of the things her mother tells her that makes her feel so unappreciated and her mother says, “That’s what we’re supposed to say. That’s what Chinese say. We like to say the opposite.” After Brave Orchid says this, Maxine’s argument is rendered pointless. It becomes obvious that Maxing was just misunderstanding her mother because of a cultural difference. After this Maxine talks about how she looks things up more to understand the real meaning, and how she wants to go to China so that she understands the real deal with communism. She has started to realize that she doesn’t really know as much as she thinks she thought and becomes more open to compromise. Uncertainty and patience are more prominent at the end as she learns to understand a situation better before jumping to conclusions.
I am calling time on this post.
ReplyDelete2. I think this chapter was important because it gives a background about Maxine's mother and how she really wanted her daughter to be a housewife. However, it is ironic that back in China Brave Orchid was a woman warrior in her own way. The chapter shows how her mother went from a traditional housewife to a great warrior woman, with a very high education. Her mother can almost be like a role model for her. It was a side of her mother that she had never known before, I think that's why this chapter was so relevant.
ReplyDelete2. We need the chapter “Shaman” in The Woman Warrior by Maxine Kingston because it gives insights into the Chinese background of the mother’s occurrences of her lifetime. It also shows the mother daughter relationship between Maxine and Brave Orchid and how Maxine looks up to her mother and admires her ability to be strong and wise. If is important for the reader to know about the life of Maxine’s mother Brave Orchid in China to demonstrate the characteristics of the women and to explain the reasons for the occurrences brought upon woman in that particular time. Although, Maxine’s mother Brave Orchid is not the protagonist in The Woman Warrior, Kingston spends a great deal of time providing such detailed developmental of her character because her mother is a mold of Maxine’s life. The mother is kept responsible for the reactions and beliefs that Maxine faces throughout the novel. The mother’s stories have an effect on Maxine that changes her whole way of thinking. The stories being told by her mother makes Maxine second guess everything her mother has been telling her because she does not believe that they are true, more importantly, the story about Maxine’s brother and sister. Maxine is caused to have a different outlook on life based on Brave Orchid’s actions throughout the chapter “Shaman”.
ReplyDeleteQuestion 2:
ReplyDeleteThe reason I believe Shaman is included in this novel, even though the focus is on Brave Orchid, is because Brave Orchid symbolizes China. We know that Maxine has never been to China, but because of her mother she has been brought up with Chinese traditions. If it were not for Brave Orchid, Maxine would have no true link to her “home”. I believe this chapter has a lot to do with the way Maxine defines herself as a Chinese-American girl. Her mother plays a huge role in the way she views herself and the way she is viewed by the rest of the community. In one part of the chapter, Maxine describes how “my mother funneled China into our ears” (76). This is a strong image that Kingston uses. While I was reading, I imagined Brave Orchid literally funneling the entire country of China into her daughter. In the interview we watched in class Maxine Hong Kingston speaks about how her mother compliments her writing by saying how accurate she was in describing China (including landscape, traditions, and beliefs). I find this amazing for someone who has never been personally, but it seems as though she has been there through her mother’s experiences. Similarly, she states that her mother “pries open my head and my fists and crams into them responsibility for time, responsibility for intervening oceans” (108). There are many passages included in Shaman describing how her mother overloads her with Chinese culture, and it is because of Brave Orchid’s talk-stories and the passing of Chinese traditions and viewpoints that Maxine is able to identify herself as being a Chinese-American.
I agree with a few other people who stated that they believe another reason this chapter is so important because it points out how hypocritical Brave Orchid behaves. She tells her daughter stories of how she was an important doctor in China, and in the same breath she tells her that girls are worthless and incapable of anything important. It gives the reader a way of empathizing with Maxine. It shows how strong of a person she is to have overcome this verbal abuse and how she did not use it as an excuse to make nothing of herself. I believe Maxine Hong Kingston was reaching out to readers who have had similar experiences and telling them not to listen to the oppressive things people sometimes force feed you, but instead make your own conclusions and be confident in yourself.